Dental Bun Podcast
Embrace the sassy, classy and messy bits of dentistry with the perfect blend of life and work wisdom.
Dental Bun Podcast
Anne Guignon's Guide to Career Creativity in Dentistry
Join us on the Dental Bun Podcast for an enlightening conversation with Anne Guignon. In our discussion, we cover the vital role of integrating dental care products into everyday practice, enhancing both patient care and professional satisfaction. Anne opens up about the importance of self-care for dental hygienists, urging us all to overcome the guilt of investing in ourselves. With heartfelt reflections on the challenges of the dental profession.
Anne's journey is anything but ordinary—driven by a thirst for creativity and autonomy that traditional practices couldn't quench. Her story showcases the power of a supportive workplace that values innovation and lifelong learning. As Anne shares her transformative experiences in her dental hygiene career and entrepreneurial leaps, you'll find inspiration in her commitment to personal and professional growth.
Anne will be delivering the Live Webinar course:
Title: pH is just the beginning... Why the right test matters
Nov. 17th, 2024 at 6:30pm MST
Register at: www.denstudyclub.com
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Welcome to the Dental Fun Podcast. My name is Janice and I'm your host, and today our guest is Anne Gill, so I did some snooping on you a little bit, you know, on LinkedIn and things like that. You have been in dentistry for such a long time and I feel like it's really important for people to understand how to continue to have the longevity of the career, because everyone's wanting to get the heck out.
Speaker 2:My thought. Coming back to the hygienist today, I've never been bored as a dental hygienist, ever. What bored me were dentists who wanted to put me in a box and tell me exactly how to think of what to do, and I didn't ever last very long with anybody like that, because either leave me alone or support me in being creative and inventive and asking questions. So to me, clinical practice was fascinating. Patient engagement was fascinating, and just as soon as you think you understood what was going on with the patient, they'd walk in and some life crisis had hit or some medication had changed or maybe their health has changed or their stress level ramped up, and I instinctively understood all these things impacted and I can clearly remember because I think in pictures I can clearly remember, like my patients who had dry mail, I didn't know how to help them. I didn't know what to do.
Speaker 2:Like my patients who had dry mail, I didn't know how to help them. I didn't know what to do. Or my patients who had chronic gingivitis or periodontitis I didn't know what to do. So I just started doing bizarre things and the more questions I asked, the more questions I had. Then I think, too, the other thing that factored into why I never got bored is I did work primarily with doctors who would just let me leave me alone and let me be inventive and creative, and that was huge for me. I wouldn't have lasted in dental hygiene had that not happened.
Speaker 1:Everyone has different stages of our careers. We're just coming out, we're learning, getting confident. You start to either work in a space that's really great for you or not, and then, of course, understand what type of growth you want. Sometimes you know, for me I love technology and if I worked in a practice that really didn't have that growth in technology, that would be boring to me. For you, when you look back, what is something that you at the time probably didn't realize but that you're glad you go? I need that in my career so that I can continue to be engaged.
Speaker 2:I think that's a great question and actually it's so complex for me. I think I accidentally fell into dental hygiene. I was supposed to become a registered nurse and I believe okay. So I have a strong, strong feeling about spirituality and that I really truly believe that the universe and in my world it's the Holy Spirit guide you. So my college classmates now say, oh, we knew you were going to be different, we knew you were going to do something. And I said you did, I didn't know that. And they go oh yeah, we knew, we always knew, because you were always asking why. So, as I look backwards, every single step I took was absolutely critical for why I am where I am Like. At my college graduation I looked at my mom and I said I'm not doing this clinical dental hygiene thing. This is boring.
Speaker 2:You know the way I was educated at the University of Missouri, kansas City, in the 60s. It was boring, it was cookie cutter and I just I was going crazy. So I had applied to the School of Public Health to go get a graduate degree and I started that and then I dropped out and then, 13 years later, I went back because I wanted the education, I wanted to complete something that I started and, oh my gosh, holy cow, the School of Public Health was the absolute, complete antithesis of a dental school. The dental school was very rigid, very regimented, very cookie cutter and, oh boy, I didn't really fit. But I mean, I was there, I was stuck and I was going to finish. So I finished that bachelor's degree in dental hygiene and then went to a school of public health that literally had no required courses. Everything was pass, fail and the philosophy of the school was we are here to support you in your education. It is your job to design the education you need to move out into the world. Well, for a creative soul, that is like a 10-course banquet of everything you ever wanted to have. And it was great because it allowed me to really be super creative and inventive.
Speaker 2:And when I went back the second time in the 80s, I became really interested in survey research, design and I thought about why is it that? I who said I'm not going to do this clinical dental hygiene thing because it's boring, I stayed in and I loved it. I found it exhilarating. Well, a number one, I had a boss, a dentist, who wasn't going to micromanage me, and I can verify that because this is not a figment of my imagination. Catherine Gilliam, another speaker, came to work in that office in the 80s and she saw what I was doing and the two of us were just like we were like running around doing whatever we wanted to do because he didn't want to be part of it. So we learned a lot from each other and then she moved on. But at least I have verification that what I was doing really did happen.
Speaker 2:So getting that master's degree was amazing. It also set me up for a challenge because I wanted to have a really good study about job and career satisfaction in dental hygiene, because I thought that was the perfect case of why it should have failed. And I figured out that continuing education and membership in ADHA were critical to why I still felt enthusiastic. So, being kind of an overachiever, I set high goals for myself and then during COVID, well, the whole meeting world kind of stopped. So I built a platform to do CEs. I got my AGD provider for the Out of the Box Learning Academy. I took master classes from speaker buddies in the National Speakers Association and, coming back to that, I was the first hygienist in NSA to ever get the top earned credential, which is called a CSB. Now, that is a club of two. They're two dental hygienists. That is a club of two. They're two dental hygienists.
Speaker 2:The other thing that really impacted on my career was in the 80s. I started buying my own equipment. I was being told no, we can't, we don't have the budget, we don't have this, we don't have that. Well, I was getting hurt physically and so I started buying my own equipment and then I temped for a period of about 10 years in the 80s, which was a time when there were not a lot of temp jobs available. So you are really subject to the whims of the doctor in the office and I'm rolling in there with my own chair to sit in my own ultrasonic. Oh yeah, I know.
Speaker 2:I think, it's wonderful, like I mean, it was wonderful, except that the doctors didn't like it. So then I had to start, I had to revert to lying to get to, just to not make a fuss. And I'd say you know, I just want to let you know I'm gonna bring a few things so that I can keep all my focus on your patients, because that's what you're hiring me to do, is take care of your people. And I want you to know that I'm going to bring a few things, like my own chair. I know you have chairs, dr, wonderful, but I have a bad back so I have to use a special chair. The answer is I didn't have a bad back, but that's often their egos. You know, when I was running in there with loops well, a lot of doctors weren't wearing loops at that point I had my own headlight. I was such an outlier that there are literally doctors in this town of Houston who've never forgotten me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but when you're carving a path we look at history Most of those people in the beginning of their path, people were not kind and nice to them. Someone has to start the path. Usually the person that starts it, that's the person that gets the rocks thrown at, that's the person that you know gets ridiculed. But then once people are like, oh, I understand this, then you get the other people that start to come in and it's you know, it starts to become natural and normal.
Speaker 2:I am eternally grateful. I joined the Dental Hygiene Association in 1981. And I took over Continuing Ed and there was no required continuing ed at the time, so I felt like continuing education was critical. My colleagues in Houston, texas, who are members of what is the Greater Houston Dental Hygienists Association I cannot thank them enough. They believed in me. The first time I ever did a CE course well, it was actually the second one, but my second one was here in Houston. The course sold out. Now here's a room full of a hundred hygienists.
Speaker 2:I'm talking about ergonomics. This was the year 2000,. It was October 2000. I got it was standing room. Only I got a standing ovation. Everybody in that crowd had known me for decades. They knew all the weird things about me, all the sad things, all the happy things.
Speaker 2:I brought ergonomics to the table for our profession in 2000. I brought it to the profession About a year ago. I was at a local dental hygiene association and I was talking to a bunch of my colleagues afterwards and they said you taught us so much about ergonomics and you taught us this 30 years ago and they were just thanking me for what I had done. But in reverse they kept me from going nuts. They really supported me my CE courses. I don't care what I'm doing, the audiences are gonna be doing something. That's just what I'm known for. I mean, I'm known for rolling in a 27 inch suitcase, opening it up and it kind of looks like the circus came to town. You know my current programs that I'm doing that involve celery pH and testing. I refer to having people spitting and dipping.
Speaker 2:Ew, I mean it has to be done, but that just sounds like spitting in a cup, dip it in a piece of ph paper, I don't know um, so I what I also know about continuing education is it needs to be fun. Yes, it needs to be actionable, but it also needs to be real, where you can really do it, and nobody wants to spend two hours listening to a talking head on whether it's in the room or online. You've got to keep it moving, you've got to keep it engaged, and I think probably the hardest thing I ran into are the hygienists and I think this is a defense mechanism who go well, my doctor will never let me do that, or we just can't possibly do that.
Speaker 1:You and I both are very I'm pretty direct as a clinician I created a seat at the table. Regardless if there's a seat available or not, I'm going to find a way. So when someone is in the clinical setting and they are not a dominant person like you and I and they're wanting, they're wanting to, let's say, now, because you will be speaking on pH and you're going to give us all this wonderful information and we're excited about it and we're going to go back and go. This is what I'd like to start in our practice is what I'd like to start in our practice. What can that person do to help try to get that seat at the table to go? I'd really like to initiate this change in our practice. I love this question. I love this question.
Speaker 2:Here's my recommendation Okay, if you want only the desk buy-in, okay, fine, yeah. But you know, but what if you want the buy-in of everybody like including your high joes down the hall who goes? I've been doing this for 30 years. I know what I'm doing. Here's what I would say I would go to whoever is planning or responsible for the office meetings. I would have this planned out. You don't wing this. If you don't have a personality like you and I have, you do not wing this. You have a plan.
Speaker 2:So you say I took this great CE. I found out information that I think is really going to help this practice in our patients. So you take the focus off of you and you put it on helping the practice and the patients, because that's what the doctors want. They want the practice to grow and be different and be a place people want to come to and refer their buddies and pals to. So you say I've got some information. I really want to share this with the team. Can I have five minutes, 10 minutes, 15 minutes, whatever kind of time you can negotiate? Five minutes, 10 minutes, 15 minutes, whatever kind of time you can negotiate? I'd like to show you just a little bit about what I've learned or why I think this really can make a difference. I was stunned by what I learned and I think it'll help the practice grow and help us provide better care for the patients.
Speaker 2:Let's pretend you love all-day sprayylitol spray or all-day gel, or you love both. Let's pretend you love both. Let's pretend you love xylomilks, um, let's pretend you love basic bites arginine chews. So the strategy for that is again to help the office know that. You know maybe the office can buy in that these products are things to recommend. But what if you had a Baskin Robbins approach? You had a bag of Basic Bites, caramel and a bag of all-day spray, or a bottle of all-day spray, a bottle of all-day gel, and you had a bottle of xylomelt.
Speaker 2:I'd like you to taste it to see if it's something that you would be interested in, if the flavor works for you or if the texture works, they'll understand the texture and the taste. Then Now, once somebody eats that, it tastes like candy, I think they're going to go buy it and use it, and for $264 a year they literally drop the relative risk for caries and erosion. So what I'm saying is create conversations that are not going to go in. Well, dr Wonderful, I want this because I want it and I think it's going to be good. Yeah, no, whiny, whiny, whiny. No, you surround it with some a plan.
Speaker 1:So come into the table with how is it going to benefit the practice, how is it going to benefit the patient, and then creating a way that they can experience it themselves. Right yeah, absolutely. And then, of course, cost, because a big barrier for most practices is cost, either the cost to the practice to purchase it or the cost to the patient. Let me pivot real quick to a fun question to get to know you a little bit better. So if I was to get in the car with Ann, what kind of music am I going to be listening to in your car? What kind of what? What kind of music am I going to be listening to in your car? You're not no music. What is it that you listen to? Oh, okay, oh okay, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:So I'm an information junkie I knew it so I am, um, I'm a pbs person.
Speaker 2:Pbs is on in the, or national public radio is on in the background here right now. So when it comes to music, though, I love jazz I grew up in Kansas City and I love jazz it just makes sense. I love classical music. It makes sense. I like bluegrass, I like country music. I don't know that there's a kind of music that I don't like. I think that jazz and blues resonate with me to my very core. So I appreciate music, I appreciate the words. I'd probably say there's probably nothing that I don't like. You just won't hear it in my car because I'm a news junkie, I'm an information junkie. I'm an information junkie.
Speaker 1:When you look back at your career, are there. I don't know that there's a time period where people don't necessarily have a ton on their plate Like we. Just, it doesn't matter what phase in life really, there's always a lot of stuff going on. But if you were to look at dentistry and talk with clinicians about areas in their career that they need to give themselves grace, okay and I think that's a really important question because I see so much angst online among clinicians, the clinicians who feel sad, defeated, anxious, undermined, non-supported.
Speaker 2:And boy do I understand that feeling. I didn't have that that much in the clinical setting, but I have had it as a speaker or as a writer. So I mean it's the same. You are on a pathway for a writer. So I mean it's the same. You are on a pathway for a reason, and I already mentioned that. I don't think I could have shed what I've done. The pathway was set, I just didn't understand it and I didn't hear the calling until the 2000s. But once I understood the calling, I could get it.
Speaker 2:But coming back to this, there would be clinicians who would shake their heads and act like I was nuts or companies that would act like I was nuts, and it always felt bad. It still feels bad because I go into whatever I'm doing with what. I will say it this way with pure intentions. Yes, I like getting paid. That's always kind of a nice thing, but that's never been my driver, ever. I don't care if it was clinical, I don't care if it's writing, I don't care if it's speaking. Yeah, I like getting paid, but it's not my driver. I don't care if it's speaking yeah, I like getting paid, but it's not my driver. I wouldn't assume that I wouldn't take anything personally.
Speaker 2:I think that people tend to and I don't know if I did or didn't with patients, but the world is much harder now, and so the fact they just show up and they know we just have a job. Our professional responsibility is to provide information and you never know what they're going to hear. You never know when they're going to walk in and go. Hey, I want you to know. I quit smoking. I followed that little tip you gave me. I picked my granddaughter's birthday to quit smoking. I did it. You don't know. So I just think I think we get overly personal. We get overly sensitive, thinking people are being rude to us or not listening. I don't know. I'm not in clinical right now so I can't address the rudeness that people keep talking about, but I'm not so sure that's not new. I just think social media has given a very loud megaphone to a whole lot of negativity, and our job is to provide care for people we're in health care and the fact that somebody carved in an hour or two out of their day to drive across the street or city to come spend an hour with us is incredible.
Speaker 2:Now the other part of this that okay, so that's with the patient. The other part of it is with not having enough time. This business of double columns now remember I had all my own equipment. There's no way I'd do a double column 30 years ago tomorrow. This is this is crazy. Now, is it possible to do something like that? Yes, but the setup has to be pristine and there has to be an ironclad rule. If your assistant or that second room isn't available, whatever, if the system's not 100%, then the system has to stop and go back to what it was before.
Speaker 2:I think that's a very complicated thing right now to negotiate with offices, because dentists have a couple weeks training in becoming a hygienist, where we have two years plus that extra year, where we have two years plus that extra year. So we're being supervised and controlled by, and hired by, a professional provider who really doesn't understand what we do, but we also really don't understand what they do. So the only person who's really going to understand all of that is the person who's been a dental hygienist is now a dentist. The person who's been a dental hygienist is now an office manager. So I think that's really complicated and I think that in today's world, if you can't negotiate something that is respectful of our time and our capabilities and ethics oh that's another big sticking point Then you know what. The time is ripe to find something else. And I'm not a big quitter, I'm sure you figured that out, but I think us staying in abusive relationships is crazy. That's where your professional organization comes in and is so supportive, because your colleagues are going to help you through those dark times.
Speaker 1:My last question and ask of you people are you know they're going to be listening and, from the career that you've had, what are three things that you can think of that are most important for someone to help keep?
Speaker 2:them engaged in their career. Well, first of all, the salvation for me. First of all, the salvation for me was being a lifelong learner. Before that was even a concept, but I mean, I guess I grew up asking questions, so I think that continuously learning has really fueled my brain and kept me engaged, and it's still keeping me engaged. I mean, apparently I don't understand how to spell the word retirement, because I should be retired and I'm going well. When's my next speak engagement? You know when's my next article or when's my next, whatever I'm doing. So lifelong learning.
Speaker 2:Second thing that I think was critical for me was getting all my own equipment and investing in myself. That meant that I didn't have to be subservient to someone else's idea of what was going to protect Dan's body, and I knew my body was really, really, really headed south and I didn't want that. I think. The third thing that is really important and it may not I think it's a harder concept to understand for some people I grew up poor. Then I had a starter husband and I got to pay all the bills because all the credit was in my name, even though he had all the stuff. I had the bills, so at 45, I had to start over again. I had nothing. I had a house that was worth nothing and I had, I think, a little IRA. That was it, 45, I had to start over. I think one of the important things to do so lifelong learning, having your own equipment by living within your means and being able to protect yourself financially. And this is a really, really hard point for a lot of women. They want to say to me well, I've got to put my kids through college and I'm going. Oh, no, you don't. I mean, I'm the oldest of seven. My family gave me a little tiny bit of money, but I got scholarships, loans, grants and worked two hours, a total of 30 hours a week. In undergrad school. I bought one pair of jeans, I bought a little Volkswagen. I couldn't afford a radio, but I understood the value of money and at 45, I said I'm never living like that again. You know, I got suckered into a lifestyle that was crazy. So I think, planning for retirement, living within your means, it's just been glorious.
Speaker 2:I made a decision for myself when I started earning 1099 income as a speaker writer. I didn't understand certain things. Yet In 2005, I found out about something called a solo 401k. I immediately opened one up and that is a financial tool that you can use if you have your own business, which I had a speaking writing business and I was being paid as a 1099. So I made the decision not to live off any of that 1099 money in particular. I opened up the account and I funded it to its maximum every single year. Two years ago I rolled it into a retirement IRA. It was astonishing what I was able to do with, what I've been able to do with that. So, at 45, starting over with nothing, 30 years later, I could retire completely and I could be doing some major vacations, you know, three or four times a year if I wanted to.
Speaker 2:I've taught myself a lot about money and you know I have that, and I've, you know, done some short-term IRAs or CDs that have had good returns. I've done a multiple number of things and I think that women, whether you're married, have a partner you need your own money. You need your own money and you need to have a certain amount of money that you don't have to explain to anybody else. That's something we did recently and I just love it. My husband has a finance degree and he is an incredibly conservative investor. He does treasury bills only that's it. I, on the other hand, have my little pile of money and I've got it diversified into all different kinds of things. I'm enjoying it because I'm seeing my money grow and I'm tracking it and it is fun. I just think those are.
Speaker 2:The financial aspect is something we're not, and the financial and business aspect is we're not well-versed. We didn't learn any of that in school, unless you were trained in your family. You didn't learn it, and we're certainly not going to get a big education about business and finance working in dentistry, other than to watch people who don't know how to manage business and finance. So money is a tool. It doesn't bring happiness. But, boy, having enough money when, like, something bad happens, your house floods or your refrigerator dies or somebody runs into your car, and having enough money where you don't have to sweat it into your car, and having enough money where you don't have to sweat it, you can go and replace whatever it is or get something fixed, it's huge, I guess.
Speaker 2:Coming back to the days when I had no money, I had to balance my checkbook to the penny, one of the things I said I'll never do. I'm never balancing a checkbook again ever. I don't like doing that. So always make sure I have enough money in my checking account. I never balance it. I go look at it, I'll move money into it, but no, I'm not going to balance it. And Derek hands me all the bank statements, I'll go, oh, I need you to to balance it. And Derek hands me all the bank statements, I'll go, oh, I need you to look at this. And I'm going, no, you don't. I just I don't like it. But this is it. Lifelong learning Protect your body and your mind. You'll go crazy if your body starts hurting. That is a fast track to burnout. I think a lot of hygienists feel really guilty about spending, you know, a dime on themselves. I'd say get over that. Take care of yourself, because you're going to be crabby and icky if you don't.
Speaker 1:I love that. Well, I was what you expected today. No, I love the tree. I mean, this is, this, is, this is what I think moves the needle for people when they're sitting in their car or they're kind of looking you know, looking to listen to something. It's not the CE sometimes that gets them motivated.
Speaker 1:You know, it is a little tidbit of someone's experience in life that can change someone's life for the positive, because sometimes you feel like you're by yourself and you sometimes feel like you're the only one that maybe feels that way and in reality there are many people that are feeling those same things and you just need that one person to go. Hey, it's going to be okay and this is how I got through this. Or hey, you're doing what you're supposed to be doing and you're doing amazing. Don't let anyone else make you feel otherwise. Well, thank you so much, anne, for being my guest this week on the Dental Bun Podcast and of course, we will have Anne on the Dense Study Club for her course that will be coming up here in a few weeks. So thank you all for joining us today, and I just had a wonderful time with Anne today.
Speaker 2:Oh, it was wonderful. I can't wait so we're going to get together in a couple of weeks, but what a wonderful time with you and thank you so much for your interest in what I'm going to be doing with your study club, but also just your interest in what I've been able to do in my professional career. So thanks, thank you.